#SenecaProud

Wed, 2/23 11:21AM • 37:40

faculty, conversation, shared, offer, bit, move, people, history, language

Randy Pitawankwat, Pat Perdue

 

Pat Perdue  00:00

Hey, I'm Pat Perdue, and I'd like to welcome you to season four of the Seneca proud podcast. Okay, so COVID isn't quite a thing of the past, but it's gonna be. And that's great news, because we've got our sights set on an amazing future. And I hope you do too. Students will be returning to classes, little by little classes will be offered in a more inclusive way, using leading edge technologies. And we're getting set for an incredibly bright, inclusive, equitable future. And the future is what Seneca proud Season Four is all about. Everything from the near term future of life at Seneca College, in a post pandemic world, it's going to be pretty great to what life after Seneca means. And hey, if you're a student, I get that life after Seneca is something that's on your mind. What are you going to do? Are you going to measure up to the competition? And what can you do today to really set yourself up to succeed? To help with those questions. This season includes graduated Seneca students who have been out there doing their thing for at least a few years. We'll hear their ups and their downs, and what you can do to help set yourself up for success. So if you haven't already, subscribe, and download and join me as we consider the future and meet the people who are transforming dreams into reality. Because the next episode of Seneca proud starts now.

 

Welcome back to the Seneca proud Podcast. I'm Pat Perdue. And as I am with every episode, I'm really glad you decided to take time out of your day to join us. Right now at Seneca many students are studying for and writing midterms. Faculty are getting ready to grade those midterms and soon, it's going to be study week, everyone looks forward to study week.

 

01:53

And of course, the week after study week, Seneca will begin the process of reopening. That means people on campus talking, buying coffee going to the library, almost like it used to be. And if you're anything like me, you're pretty excited about that. But it's not entirely like it used to be. There's been a tremendous amount of change over the past two years. Yeah, it's been two years, most notably in the area of EDI equity, diversity and inclusion. Part of that is about how curriculum needs to be demonstrably inclusive overall. And in the case of our episode today, inclusive of our shared history with indigenous peoples. But what does that really mean? How to non Indigenous profs and curriculum planners know if their course content is inadvertently excluding or even denying indigenous perspectives and worldviews? Well, in the absence of seeking out media that isn't in one's own worldview, and questioning and lots of listening, and some pretty serious work. The truth is, we can't know that because we have blind spots, lots of them. I'm going to suggest, though, that it's in fact, probably a pretty safe assumption that without some serious work, the course material excludes indigenous voices and perspectives, and probably others, and by excluding them denies them. If it sounds like a big deal. It's because it's a big deal. Okay, so now that you know, what do you do about that? Well, this brings us to our guests today. And the topic of today's show. Skoden, as I learned from our guest today, is an Anishinabe word that means, "Let's go then!" And it's also the name of the 12 week program at Seneca that helps faculty begin to understand how they can incorporate indigenous perspectives into their course materials. As you will hear from our conversation today, the scope and course is an intense 12 weeks co facilitated by our guests and other faculty from FirstPeoples@Seneca, who share personal stories colonial history, treaty history, and ultimately our collective shared history as treaty partners.

 

Okay, so let me tell you about today's guest, Randy Pitawanakwat. Randy is a faculty member at Seneca College who works out of Odeyto First Peoples at Seneca. We were very fortunate to have a tour of Odyeto in season two of the Seneca proud podcast. Huge thank you to Peggy Pitawanakwat for facilitating that. I'll leave a link to that episode in the show notes. Randy co facilitates two professional development courses Skoden and Stoodis. Stoodis, as you'll hear is the follow up portion of Skoden. They're offered through the Teaching and Learning Department at Odeyto.

 

Pat Perdue  04:32

Randy is from Wiikwemkoong Unceded Territory and Atikameksheng Anishinabek First Nation. Previously, Randy worked with the indigenous community in the Toronto area for over 11 years in the social work profession. Much of Randy's knowledge is a collective of understandings from oral tradition and experiences throughout his life in Wiikwemkoong and Atikameksheng Anishinabek.  We join our conversation with Randy talking about how the Skoden course began and what it means to participate in Skoden. And Randy shares some of his journey that led him to his role as an indigenous faculty member at FirstPeoples@Seneca. Okay, let's go then! See what I did there? Here's my conversation with Skoden co-facilitator, Randy Pitawanakwat.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  05:16

So when Skoden and it really kind of came out of the fact that there was there's a number of requests being asked of the staff at Odeyto. And our Dean of Student Services and our boss, Mark Solomon, came up with the idea to try and get more coverage of our content in Indigenous awareness. And also in coming to our realization of what we need to do with the call to action and truth and reconciliation. In the, like I said, the call to action and what that means to our institution, which we have a responsibility to ensure that we try to include as much content Indigenous content as possible in scope and started its early development through some of those lenses.

 

Pat Perdue  06:02

Love it, love it, and Skoden as we're talking about means, let's go, let's do this.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  06:07

Yeah, it's kind of the first step that you take when you start to ask those questions and start to see what's going on. And you want to know a little bit more, but you don't know where to start, or you have a lot of questions around. You know, how do I begin to unpack our shared history? Well, Let’s go then! And let's, let's learn together.

 

Pat Perdue  06:28

That's a question that a lot of people ask, it's a question that I've often asked, what's the first step, and as a professor, if we want to move in that direction, I guess we can call you. And then what happens?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  06:39

Yes, so we kind of put that professional course or professional development course through our teaching and learning department where you sign up for courses in general. And then And then sometimes if there's enough requests from a specific program, will actually offer their own individualized program through teaching and learning, if there's enough faculty members to enroll in Skoden, and it's not a requirement, there's nothing saying that you have to there's been some talk about to whether that should be part of our three series teaching and learning that every faculty member bolster, in order to I guess, become a well seasoned faculty member. But at this point, now, it's an optional course that faculty can take. And it's it's been absolutely a privilege for myself to be able to say that we've done so many now. And we've had so many people through the program that we're absolutely thrilled with, what they've learned and the outcomes that have happened,

 

Pat Perdue  07:42

if you can give us a peek inside. What happens during that 12 weeks. Is it a little bit about colonial history, Indigenous people history? Is it looking specifically at the course content and identifying blind spots?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  07:58

Yeah, absolutely. So we've really taken Skoden into whole new levels. We're actually just at the final stages, as well as putting out a neat campus Ontario Press book, that basically is your, your guide to everything scouted. And it was developed with Seneca staff and faculty and in myself, and so we walk you through together, they're both 12 weeks if we're for connecting in person. And, and we talk about everything from truth and reconciliation, centering yourself on the land, colonial history, pre contact history, the importance of treaty making residential school history, call to action, the MMIWT 2SLGBTQI people, the calls for justice and cultural safety in our classrooms, which is an important part and allyship in decolonization and moving forward in a good way. And basically, how do you define that? Right? We we had some discussion around even that, what does it mean to move forward in a good way? And so we help to unpack a lot of that content with the participants in scoring

 

Pat Perdue  09:14

That question, what does it mean to move forward in a good way? Is that something that you could speak to now it sounds like a more of a complicated question than it might appear on the surface?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  09:25

Yeah. And initially, we we also, were part of an open source paper that we wrote regarding time and how we interpret time, from an Indigenous perspective. But more so around that piece around in a good way. That was one of the pieces of feedback we got from the editor was can you explain a little bit more what you mean by doing something in a good way? And it was my first time where I guess it was posed to me about, well, what does that mean to you? And I hadn't thought about it as a question. Rather, it was Just a way of being. And and what that means really is that we're doing things we're moving about on the land, the best way that we know how, and not really, that doing something in a good way really has its own personal meaning to each individual purse. But what it could mean really, as a whole, is that we're acknowledging, you know, the land that we're on. And we're looking at what's important to us, which is usually the land, if we're looking at it that way. But also, we're looking at it from a perspective of what's important for us that we leave behind for our next generation. And so I was looking forward, but also looking back. So having that perspective around doing things in a good way, so that we know that we're trying to secure that same comfort that we have for our next generation. So it's always about thinking about somebody else.

 

Pat Perdue  10:55

And is that one of the lightbulb moments or the watershed moments that attendees of Skoden have?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  11:03

I think, yes, you know, that happens almost, that happens throughout the entire 12 weeks together. And it gets right now, I would say it's pretty intense, because we're talking about our colonial history, the legacy, the importance of treaties, and pre contact history. And, again, moving together in a good way. A lot of times, there's kind of three, two to three different ways that participants will kind of go towards when they start to hear some of our history or shared history together. It appears anyway, but they won't, some of them sometimes will come out and say it. But it almost appears that there's maybe a bit of shame, and disbelief and sadness sometimes. And we have an Elder, Elder Blu, who also has helped co facilitate our sessions, which has been just an amazing opportunity for us to have an Elder to be helping guide us through this content as well, and offer her knowledge and teachings every week. So she's there to help to, to talk a little bit more you know about some of these topics, that's one of the things that I try to help facilitate is that the stuff that's being shared the content that's being shared, it's not meant to be an opportunity to put blame on any particular person or community. However, it's just finally having the the platform to share our history, right, the shared history that we have together, and to move forward that we have now we have this knowledge. So what are we going to do about it moving forward. So I think they do digest that eventually. And they're able to move through it. But it can be a fairly quiet, I don't know, if you have much experience in a classroom setting with college students, but sometimes it could be just yourself, doing much of the talking. And that's okay. Because we offer opportunity for sharing circles and in chances for them to reach out whenever they feel comfortable. And so once we can get through some of those sections and scope in that deal with that history, we can move forward and, and when we have moments where things are very upsetting. And we have moments where it's very emotional, even for myself, because a lot of the content that I share, I'm sharing, not necessarily just from a outsider's view, but from a viewpoint where I've actually gone through some of his history, because of, you know, my family being Indigenous, so. So it's, it's, it's healing. In the end, it's a really healing opportunity for myself. And I think for some of the participants who some of them really, really kind of get up and they start putting on their running shoes, and they just start or their work boots or whatever that whatever you want to whatever you want to put on. And they they get to work and they go to their chair, and they say, We need to change this, we need to talk about this. And maybe it starts with the land acknowledgement. Maybe it starts with something more. But we have a lot of graduates from Skoden that take this very seriously, and share with us, you know, their, what they've shared even with their family. And that's what we want. We don't want this to be just a work related issue, because it's not really even has anything to do with our work, but it does impact what decisions we make as far as content. But it also should impact your if we're doing it right, that should impact your life on a personal level,

 

Pat Perdue  14:41

As you were describing the process and the result of the process. Now we now that we know. Now what that's Skoden. Right. Such a perfectly named program!

 

Randy Pitawankwat  14:55

Yes!  So that's why we have that follow up for the participants to say, Now that you know, now that we've shared now that we've likely all cried together in some way or form, now, what are we going to do? Well, okay, let's do this, then, now that we've moved through it, and we're able to say that, okay, we now know the information, what are we going to do now? So that's the next step. So then we have a community of practice that we call it to students.

 

Pat Perdue  15:23

I was going to ask, is there a, okay, now that you're done the 12 week program, good luck out there? Or is there some sort of mechanism where people can continue to reconnect and continue to dialogue around their journey of, of improving the content?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  15:39

Exactly. And in so that exact that is exactly what students is all about? And why we structured it in such a way that is allowing us to expand upon a lot of questions that actually, you know, what I'll say is that a lot of times when we are done scouting, there's still a lot of questions. In my estimation, that's what we want. We almost want more questions, and then kind of, you know, kind of dusting your hands and saying, Okay, well, that's done now. Now, check that box. Rather, it's about actually, I have way more questions now than I ever have. When I first started scouting. So what do I do now? That's where students really kind of blends in. And it's an open community of practice where any faculty members that are graduates of scouting can come and join at any time at all. It's not something where you have to follow, you know, a regimented schedule, it's when you have time, and we offer two different slots for you to do so. And you come with, with what's on your heart, and what's on your mind. And, and maybe you've done something in your classroom where you want to do something, or you have an assignment that you're you're wondering, you know, maybe I need to massage this a little more, or what do you think, is missing here? I have this, this and this, or I have this land acknowledgement that I'm working on. But I'm kind of getting caught up in a couple of details, can you help clarify something, or I had a really bad week. You know, there's lots of students that are under a lot of pressure. And sometimes it's just almost like a group counseling session for our faculty members to come in. And just feel like they've been had a chance to have their voice heard, and, and to regroup,

 

Pat Perdue  17:27

What you're doing. And the conversations that you're having are huge and are tectonically shifting the environment….

 

Randy Pitawankwat  17:35

Yeah, and I mean, in a lot of this has really just come from a very natural process of being almost, if you will, handing the mic over to us, and saying, here's the microphone, you do what you need to do. And we'll listen, I think that's one of the most important things that we've been allowed to do is share is be able to share our stories, share experiences, share the content, share videos, share documentaries, share our voice, and have people genuinely listen. And I think that is really all our ancestors ever wanted to begin with. And so now that that mic is being passed over to us, we're definitely using that for us to be able to share in the end, that's really what we're doing with everything that we're for centering ourselves about how to de tau is about sharing our experiences and, and sharing with our student body, you know that make sure that your voice is heard. And we're here to support you as well. So it's about the students in the faculty, and we try to balance that as best we can. You know,

 

Pat Perdue  18:40

I've got one quick question. And then I'm going to maybe change the topic over to talking about you a little bit, I'd love to hear a little bit about your background and how you found yourself in this role. But before we go there, for those faculty that are interested in participating is simply a matter of going on their website and filling out the form and signing up for the next session or how does that work?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  19:01

Yeah, at this point, it almost is that easy. Unless, of course, you know, for a fact that your chair has been pressing, or has been hearing both coding and, and we'd like to potentially even have an entire scope and B be part of your you know, whatever program that you're in, for example, English and Liberal Studies, I think we've had two full fully packed classes that are dedicated to only English and Liberal Studies, faculty members, but we also have General Skoden that yeah, you just checked the website teaching and learning and when we when we get together after each semester, we talk about next steps and make sure that we try to offer at least two Skodens but again, that could change you know once we start to move back into the physical space again, so just kind of stay tuned, and don't hesitate to reach out to myself or data in general, any of the staff here will be happy to, to connect with you and make sure that you get the updates that you're looking for.

 

Pat Perdue  20:10

Thank you for that. So let's talk a little bit about Randy Pitawankwat? How did you find yourself here and how and what led you to this point in your, in your life and your leadership around this this topic?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  20:25

Yeah, I guess I could say everything that has happened to me led me here. I often share with Skoden participants that, that you try and see things from a lens of all your experiences lead you to a point in your life where you recognize this, everything that has happened to me has actually led me to this point in whether you find yourself being grateful or not for being, you know, in charge of, in some ways, co facilitating learning at the college level. And so I always say I also include some of my lesser, happy moments in my life as leading me to this point in my career, professionally. And personally, I initially started my professional career in, in the GTA in Toronto, working in social work, and working on the frontlines of social work and working with the Indigenous population in urban Toronto. And it also spending quite a number of years in the Scarborough area in supporting youth and children in the school system in the high school and elementary schools. And by virtue of doing that I was really also supporting the caregivers and the family members as well through different conversations around education, and what that means for our people and why things need to be arranged in such a way that helps facilitate learning for Indigenous children and youth. So really, I was just kind of working away and doing my thing with the community when word got out that Seneca was looking for a faculty member. And so I put my name in the hat like anybody else. And I applied. And I got the position as a faculty member. And I guess just prior to kind of getting the call at Seneca and moving through that process of applying for the position, I began to explore working at a college level with First Nations Technical Institute fnt is are known and teaching in the social service worker program. And mainly working with Indigenous population who are also a lot of them were working already professionally, but just wanted to have that diploma or that BSW as well, at the university level. So I was I began my facilitation, if you will, of learning that way with F and TI, and got my start, I guess really through that lens of sitting in circle with my community, and learning almost more from them than I actually offered to them. And I had the opportunity to travel all over Ontario, near Sarnia up to Cochran where it's closest town for a lot of the northern communities. And Moose Factory for them to come and get the train or fly in or in the winter, they would just drive on the on the ice road all the way to Cochran. So that was a very interesting experience for me. And so I would say that that me, you know, for the opportunity that Seneca offered to me, I don't think I would have been able to accept a position such as the one I'm in now, if I did to go through those years of supporting my community, on that frontline level, and then also having that little bit of experience sitting in circle with my community in that social service program. So all that in a nutshell professionally led me to, to really say yes, I think I'm ready for something like this. And it's been it's been an amazing experience. So far, I just, I didn't have much time really before we went, we went virtual. I started in January and 2020. And by March, we were getting the word that Toby best that we work from home. So I had about three months on campus before before we move things virtual. So it's been very comforting, actually, now that I look back on it working from this perspective. And so now that we're talking about a bit of a strategy to reopen at least part time, there's a bit of nervousness and anxiety there because I'm so used to this style that we have to work in person and have to get used to that challenge now to again.

 

Pat Perdue  24:53

Thank you for sharing with me your background and your history and it's clear from your description that - and I don't know why it would be in any other way - But it's obvious from your description that you bring a tremendous amount of personal knowledge, as well as I guess, formal institutional knowledge and instructional knowledge, but also personal perspective, to the conversations that you're having. miscoded. So it sounds like they can only be very impactful.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  25:24

Yeah. And I think that that's a valid point. And it's one that in, in our circle of Indigenous community, that we have to make sure that we're including that experience to our teachings, or to how we deliver content. Because that, as we say, you know, you know, a lot of people can offer, you know, can teach content, but to share an experience is, is definitely one that doesn't come easily. And you have to be able to have lived and experience in order to share how it has been for you.

 

Pat Perdue  26:02

For those listening to our conversation right now, perhaps from the Indigenous community who are thinking, wow, I'd like to get involved in that, or I'd like to become more impactful in that conversation in some way, what guidance might you have for them?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  26:19

Yeah, I would first say that, that we all have the opportunity to be able to share our experience. And it all depends how the level of comfort that you have in sharing your experiences, and in being able to have a sense of belonging to communities, such as Seneca or any other college or institution that is now starting to recognize our teachings and our knowledge and experience as even in level as a degree would be. So don't ever count yourself out because you don't have a PhD or you don't have an aspiration to be fully educated on every level. Rather, focus in on on what you've accomplished and your experiences, and even take some time to ask yourself some of those questions about, you know, where have I been, what have I done, a big part of understanding who we are, is that piece around reflection. So make sure that you have some reflection about who you are, and where you've come from, most can guarantee that you'll you could fill a memoir, that would be worth reading, that anyone would want to read in what you've accomplished already. So never try and say, Oh, I can't do that, or I haven't done enough schooling to apply to a position or to put myself out there as you would think. But I would just recommend that you just move forward and recount your experiences. And if you need support for that, then you get support to be able to work through some of those experiences, but turn those into narratives that can bring you to a new place in your understanding of who you are.

 

Pat Perdue  28:02

That sounds like great advice. And that is a process of reflection in the past. And as you look into the future of your journey, or Skoden’s journey, what would you like to happen? If you would say, in some period of time, this is an outcome that I would like to see, what might that be?

 

Randy Pitawankwat  28:29

Well, I think, I think what we're working towards now is, is exactly where we want it to go. And it's not to say that eventually will be done. And there'll be nothing left to do, as as with our language for hours, put our national demo and language on a bit of a highlight every time we meet. Because it's it's not a static language. It's not something that is that was written down many, many years ago. And it's that's the word and that's all it is. Our language is very fluid, and it flows as some make analogies to to a river, you know, flowing. You can't stop it. It's always moving. And it's always changing. And that's how I see this golden experience. And with some of our content that we have in our E Press book, there was some conversation around well, what's going to happen as we move through the years or months or as things come to light, or as new information gets revealed or more experiences get shared and more teachings get shared. Well, we have to update it and we have to build on it. And we have to change it as we see fit. And I think that's what we're we're moving towards and Skoden so that it's always going to be a fluid evolving process of sharing and teaching and learning and including, so I don't think they'll ever be it. A chance where we'll say, Well, I guess we can now take a bit of a backseat. And maybe we will, because we'll have a bunch of graduates lined up, that would be more than happy to help co facilitate potentially a Skoden. Or to organize some content that maybe we can flip into, as a student experience. There's been a lot of conversation more recently, although nothing concrete or nothing in the works yet, but there's been some conversation around language. And what does that mean? Because we know that any, anybody who attributes themselves to culture and tradition, in their own way, knows that language is such an integral part of who you are, whether you're Indigenous or non-Indigenous. And if you know, you know, two languages, you know, that your, if you could call it your mother tongue, you know, that really helps you describe and really shapes who you are as an individual. So we know that language is important. So I know that that is something that's been on our radar. Now for a little while. And I could, I could eventually see potentially some form of a missionary memo and language course or some form of even Anishenawbe literature being shared. And talking a little bit more about kind of what we're doing now, which is sharing through a very, very indigenous view, which is, which is a literacy that you can describe as being oral, an oral tradition, as having conversation as conversing back and forth through oral tradition, rather than through text or through written means. So this is about as indigenous as it can get. Which is why maybe there's so many cool indigenous podcasts out there as well, because it lends itself really well to our way of sharing knowledge.

 

Pat Perdue  31:54

There are great indigenous podcasts out there. And speaking of are there any that you would like to shout out and I can leave links to in the show notes that come to mind? I know I'm putting you on the spot a little bit.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  32:06

Yeah, well, there's the Métis in space, which is a Chelsea Vowel. She's amazing. She has a very comical but yet informative podcast. And it also there's one called I believe it's called Storykeepers. You'll have to correct me on some of the names of them if I don't have them exactly right. But I have a whole bunch that i i do have on my playlist here. And that's one the Storykeepers is with Waubgeshig Rice, who, as we know, is the author of Moon of the Crusted Snow, but yes, it is called Storykeepers. And the other one Unreserved Obviously, with Rosanna Deerchild is another amazing podcast that I'm definitely linked into, definitely check them out. The the one Storykeepers, they pick a book and Indigenous author, and they share a little bit about the content of that book. So it really highlights a number of things. A, it highlights the Indigenous authors, and then it gives you a, an Indigenous perspective of the content itself. Because we also get that question quite a bit as well. We get a lot of questions around what do you mean by that? Or what does this mean? Or? Or how do you how do you explain this? And like I was sharing with you a little bit earlier, a lot of times when we're done, we'll have more questions. And like, actually, I feel not more confused. But I have more questions. And I really have answers. And I think that that is the ongoing process of unpacking this content, is I don't think we'll ever get to a point where we can, you know, neatly and tightly put something in its place and know that we know everything about it. Because again, it's fluid, it's it's always changing, it's evolving. And I think that there's always space to ask more questions. That said, sometimes the answer that I don't like hearing, and maybe it's not one also that the staff or the faculty members don't really like hearing, when you don't just tell them just tell me the answer to the question. Sometimes there isn't one, you know, there isn't one answer to your question. And it's about again, it's going back to that reflection, you need to reflect on everything that you've taken in, we've just spent entire semester together. Don't have expectations of yourself to to be to know everything. Try and let it sit with you for a little while and see how it feels and let it come out as naturally as possible.

 

Pat Perdue  34:35

Well in in our conversation today, you've given us a lot to reflect on and to think about, in particular, how exciting this program is Skoden, and how transformative the program really appears to be for the participants. I know as a faculty member, I'm piqued so it's definitely something that I want to look into and I'm quite confident that others listening to it would feel the same way as well.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  35:05

Yeah, we always have a, you know, a policy of come and sit with us come sit. When we're in person, there's always usually food. There's always usually something to eat. So come and share and eat and spend some time together. And I think that could be part of the requirement almost, if you will have scolded when we eventually returned to campus in some physical form, is that that is one of the requirements that you come and sit with us. And if you're not hungry, well, I don't know. Then maybe let's share some tea, you know, or bring a cup of coffee and let's, let's let's share and talk together because that's really what Skoden is all about.

 

Pat Perdue  35:50

Well, on that very positive Invitational note. Thank you very much for joining the Seneca proud podcast. It's been an absolute pleasure, as I mentioned at the top of the conversation I've been really looking forward to, to our time to chat so thank you very much for setting aside some time today.

 

Randy Pitawankwat  36:08

Yeah, you know, to me, which, you know, a very big thank you to taking the time to navigate this, this time together as we all have, you know, our we're all very busy. And it was an amazing little experience for me to be part of a podcast and, and I'm very grateful to have been asked to be part of it. So be glad, Chuck. Thank you, Randy. And we're okay. For a little while, I was almost like, we started our we're still just shooting the breeze here. So I know that was that was good. You know, it's almost like you know, taking a Band-Aid on it, just do it. Don't tell me when just do it.

 

Pat Perdue  36:57

And that was my conversation with Randy Pitawankwat. Thank you for spending time with us and sharing that conversation with us today. And a huge thank you to Randy for taking time out of your really busy schedule to hang out with us on the pod. Of course, links to the podcasts Métis is Space, and Storykeepers are in the shownotes Plus, I've included some additional content that has helped my own journey including impactful book, seven fallen feathers by Tanya Talaga and Braiding Sweetgrass by Robin Wall Kimmerer. And of course for the Seneca College faculty, I've also included the link to the Skoden course in the show notes. Thank you again to this week's guest Randy Pitawankwat and thank you for listening. I'm Pat Perdue. Stay proud Seneca.